@honeycomet: It's not so much that he can't develop characters as that there isn't time or space for it. I think it's likely that he's been eyeing the video game deadline nervously for some time now and has been trying to hasten things to a timely conclusion of some sort. Trying to get something out faster is difficult enough, but there's so much going on at once now that a lot has been falling through the cracks, particularly any focus on character.
What's wrong with homestuck? It's on hiatus.
Okay, I'm just going to be... really awful now and say that if this is the point we are going to hiatus on, I could honestly see... pretty much all of the Alpha kids die and not really be bothered ~too~ much.
Pretty much the only person that I would be bothered by is Roxy, and by extension of her ties to her friends, it would really suck to have all the people she had grown to love and follow die too.
But that's pretty much it. They feel as expendable as--and probably more so--than the beta trolls that died on the meteor. :x
Pretty much the only person that I would be bothered by is Roxy, and by extension of her ties to her friends, it would really suck to have all the people she had grown to love and follow die too.
But that's pretty much it. They feel as expendable as--and probably more so--than the beta trolls that died on the meteor. :x
^I hate to say it, but I think there's an element of truth to that...
Hussie just bit off more then he could chew is pretty much the long and short of it.
He has worked hard for four years now on one thing but I don't think it's realistic to expect us as fans who've been built up for so long to get out of his obvious "I'm done with this" without any disappointment.
I can pretty much think of around 50 plot lines that I need closure for but will never get it.
(For the record though I don't agree with the above statements. I hate the concept of "expandability" because it's entirely dependent on who the author chooses to develop, not who actually is a great character. Jane, Jake, and Dirk are great characters and I personally would care very much if anything happened to any of them. Any character who comes to mean a lot to one single person and positively impacts their life is NOT expendable, relevance to the plot be damned. I hate when people write off characters so easily AUTHORS INCLUDED cough cough Hussie cough)
He has worked hard for four years now on one thing but I don't think it's realistic to expect us as fans who've been built up for so long to get out of his obvious "I'm done with this" without any disappointment.
I can pretty much think of around 50 plot lines that I need closure for but will never get it.
(For the record though I don't agree with the above statements. I hate the concept of "expandability" because it's entirely dependent on who the author chooses to develop, not who actually is a great character. Jane, Jake, and Dirk are great characters and I personally would care very much if anything happened to any of them. Any character who comes to mean a lot to one single person and positively impacts their life is NOT expendable, relevance to the plot be damned. I hate when people write off characters so easily AUTHORS INCLUDED cough cough Hussie cough)
I've just noticed that this was a sticky. That's perfect.
I always though that was strange also. Okay, maybe could get away with the majority of humans in this comic being mostly straight since the majority of humanity are mostly attracted to the opposite sex, but the trolls where it established that gender mostly does not matter? It seemed like making them pansexual was a last minute thing on Hussie's part as the majority of the troll non-platonic romantic relationships in this comic are heterosexual.
I think the only romantic relationships Hussie seems to take some semblance of seriousness are Karkat/Terezi, Rose/Kanaya, and maybe Jake/Jane seeing that one or both characters in those pairings have major character arcs that revolves around romancing the other. I could be wrong though seeing that all three have had really shakey relationships.
Pie said:
For a comic with twelve main pansexual aliens, and eight young people in the height of their sexual development, Homestuck sure has a laughably small amount of canon queer representation in it. Then you get people who don't understand why people latch on to ships like Rosemary and Pumpkin Patch (when even Pumpkin Patch got subjected to the 'I'ma ruin all ships forever because I'm Andrew Hussie and that's how I roll' phenomenon instead of being an actual groundbreaking homosexual ship in mainstream entertainment between two characters who fit none of the stereotypes and other shenanigans mainstream media like to use to depict homosexuals) with such intensity. It's not hard to figure out why the starving dog covets the steak.
I get that romance of all kinds is very clearly just a joke to Hussie within the canon story but he could have at least tried harder. You can see that in the fact that people still debate the trolls sexualities despite them very clearly being biologically pansexual.
For a comic with twelve main pansexual aliens, and eight young people in the height of their sexual development, Homestuck sure has a laughably small amount of canon queer representation in it. Then you get people who don't understand why people latch on to ships like Rosemary and Pumpkin Patch (when even Pumpkin Patch got subjected to the 'I'ma ruin all ships forever because I'm Andrew Hussie and that's how I roll' phenomenon instead of being an actual groundbreaking homosexual ship in mainstream entertainment between two characters who fit none of the stereotypes and other shenanigans mainstream media like to use to depict homosexuals) with such intensity. It's not hard to figure out why the starving dog covets the steak.
I get that romance of all kinds is very clearly just a joke to Hussie within the canon story but he could have at least tried harder. You can see that in the fact that people still debate the trolls sexualities despite them very clearly being biologically pansexual.
I always though that was strange also. Okay, maybe could get away with the majority of humans in this comic being mostly straight since the majority of humanity are mostly attracted to the opposite sex, but the trolls where it established that gender mostly does not matter? It seemed like making them pansexual was a last minute thing on Hussie's part as the majority of the troll non-platonic romantic relationships in this comic are heterosexual.
I think the only romantic relationships Hussie seems to take some semblance of seriousness are Karkat/Terezi, Rose/Kanaya, and maybe Jake/Jane seeing that one or both characters in those pairings have major character arcs that revolves around romancing the other. I could be wrong though seeing that all three have had really shakey relationships.
The infuriating thing about the same-sex relationships, or lack thereof, in Homestuck is how fucking vindictive people in the fandom can get about them. The way that people constantly try to interpret and use them, not as a point of favorable queer representation, but as some kind of metacommentary on fandom politics or what have you. I swear, the lengths people went to to interpret every single thing that happened between Dirk and Jake as a snipe against m/m "fangirls" was disgusting. See, they didn't even talk, see, Jake doesn't want to be with Dirk, see, Dirk only was into him because he was the only guy he knew and he cares way more about Roxy!! Hussie is showing you why all your anti-canon yaois would suck if they actually hooked up in canon!! Eat it fangirls!!!
I guess this is another general problem I have. The fault lies partly with the fanbase, this whole trend of Homestuck fans taking every event in the comic as validation for themselves or as an attack on the parts of the fandom they don't like, and acting like you have to have Hussie's personal approval to get invested in a certain element of the comic or you're liking it wrong. But I think Hussie exacerbates it, because of the fact that he has taken overt potshots at the fanbase in the past, through the comic or otherwise. I found the characterization of the dancestors to be a lot more mean-spirited than a lot of the fanbase seems to have taken them to be, and the fact that people now use (for example) Kankri as an excuse to make jokes about triggers and be assholes to people who take triggers seriously, just says to me that people picked up on what the character was intended to be--an attack on people. I also recall an incident way earlier in the comic's run, where people were mourning Equius' death and Hussie, on Formspring, basically laughed at them and said, "lol are you serious, this character wasn't intended to be anything more than a joke". Small wonder people constantly crave validation from Hussie when he's a dismissive prick to people who get invested in the comic in ways he doesn't intend.
Hussie is kind of a major asshole in general, is my problem, I guess.
I guess this is another general problem I have. The fault lies partly with the fanbase, this whole trend of Homestuck fans taking every event in the comic as validation for themselves or as an attack on the parts of the fandom they don't like, and acting like you have to have Hussie's personal approval to get invested in a certain element of the comic or you're liking it wrong. But I think Hussie exacerbates it, because of the fact that he has taken overt potshots at the fanbase in the past, through the comic or otherwise. I found the characterization of the dancestors to be a lot more mean-spirited than a lot of the fanbase seems to have taken them to be, and the fact that people now use (for example) Kankri as an excuse to make jokes about triggers and be assholes to people who take triggers seriously, just says to me that people picked up on what the character was intended to be--an attack on people. I also recall an incident way earlier in the comic's run, where people were mourning Equius' death and Hussie, on Formspring, basically laughed at them and said, "lol are you serious, this character wasn't intended to be anything more than a joke". Small wonder people constantly crave validation from Hussie when he's a dismissive prick to people who get invested in the comic in ways he doesn't intend.
Hussie is kind of a major asshole in general, is my problem, I guess.
I also recall an incident way earlier in the comic's run, where people were mourning Equius' death and Hussie, on Formspring, basically laughed at them and said, "lol are you serious, this character wasn't intended to be anything more than a joke"
This is why I will never let Hussie or his canon dictate to me who is "worthy" as a character. One man's horse fetish joke character is another man's connection on a deeper level.
One man's joke about physical mental and sexual abuse for the sake of being a prop to another character's whims is another man's simultaneous hero / painful reminder.
And so on and so forth.
Also man Jogn now you have me stewing on the frequent attack mentality on predominately female / queer subsets of fandom quite a bit but that's pretty big thread derailment so I just won't go there.
Grade A post though.
If I may interject, when it comes to the death of Equius, this was still during the time when Hussie could be considered to be always trolling the fanbase. All the time. And that's something I kind of liked about it is that there was no way you could take any of his side comments seriously with shitting a mile of rage snake. Now, Hussie has changed (and he's admitted to this too) and more of his commentary is genuine. The Caucasian joke incident rather stands out as when he regrets how his playful potshots at the fandom have always toed a fine line. He still maintains the "I'm a big jerk" image but maybe more conservatively. Like the subtle differences between Dave and Dirk and the irony they immerse themselves in.
Really great commentary on fandom Jogn.
His commentary on Equius was really harsh though. I was reading through some of his old comments once and that section about Equius in particular struck me as really mean spirited and made me pause, even amongst his old trolling. There is definitely a marked difference in 'trolling' Hussie and 'probably genuinely annoyed and intending to be harmful' Hussie.
His commentary on Equius was really harsh though. I was reading through some of his old comments once and that section about Equius in particular struck me as really mean spirited and made me pause, even amongst his old trolling. There is definitely a marked difference in 'trolling' Hussie and 'probably genuinely annoyed and intending to be harmful' Hussie.
Pie said:
This is why I will never let Hussie or his canon dictate to me who is "worthy" as a character. One man's horse fetish joke character is another man's connection on a deeper level.
This is why I will never let Hussie or his canon dictate to me who is "worthy" as a character. One man's horse fetish joke character is another man's connection on a deeper level.
Unfortunately, Hussie and his canon dictates a character on-screen appearances and dialogue which reflects how "worthy" a character is to him. "Oh, you wanted some dialogue from Nepeta and Feferi? Maybe Feferi interacting with Meenah or some insight on the Horrorterrors? HAHAHA! Too bad." It also adds fuel to the idea that these characters were worthless to people who weren't a fan of them.
Ninety said:
Finally, Aradia. Getting put on a bus was understandable (sorry for the overuse of TVTropes terms), and reasonable in-story. But her recent reversal as pretty much a calm psycho not only struck me as out of the blue, but a bit of a cop-out. Seems having a good, competent, sane character was just too much too ask.
Finally, Aradia. Getting put on a bus was understandable (sorry for the overuse of TVTropes terms), and reasonable in-story. But her recent reversal as pretty much a calm psycho not only struck me as out of the blue, but a bit of a cop-out. Seems having a good, competent, sane character was just too much too ask.
Actually, I was happy that Hussie revealed her to be a Chaotic Neutral Psychopomp as I thought he was going to leave her as a character-less sheep prop.
As for the fandom, again it can be awful in general even if there are some good. Tumblr and 4chan can be real cesspools if you want to talk about Homestuck since you would be mucking around an angry pile of vomit and horseshit. If I really wanted to talk about the comic, I use this board, the SomethingAwful HS thread, and plus4chan. Occasionally, HSG/4chan would have a neat discussion(it's where Metastuck originated), but 99% of the time it is shitpost after shitpost. Tumblr is where I go to search for fanart.
Unfortunately, Hussie and his canon dictates a character on-screen appearances and dialogue which reflects how "worthy" a character is to him. "Oh, you wanted some dialogue from Nepeta and Feferi? Maybe Feferi interacting with Meenah or some insight on the Horrorterrors? HAHAHA! Too bad." It also adds fuel to the idea that these characters were worthless to people who weren't a fan of them.
This is why I am a pretty big fan of Death of The Author to be honest. I've been called flat out stupid for liking characters I like one too many times by yeah those shit stirring haters who use his laughably huge imbalance of focus to justify their hatred.
It makes me too nervous to even discuss the things that I like or why I like them, which kind of blows chunks but whatever.
^Yeah, I always pegged you as a huge proponent of Death of the Author.
Haha yeah I'm a pretty transparent person about most things.
For example, your favorite mathematical constant is equal to half a circle's perimeter over its radius.